my poor hawk, my poor girlfriend.

[Soul]

Well, If anyone can take a guess at where this thread is going..
I dropped my hawk pretty hard last yr..I replaced the speedo housing and the mounting peice..the forks subframe tail plastic.
I got it rebuilt..painted the tank and was building a custom tail when I gave my 26 yr old cousin a riding lesson. The bike got a parking lot drop which killed the rear brake lever and put a nice dent in my nice tank.
My girlfriend went on her first REAL ride after small around the block trips and an hour or two in the parking lot of a closed supermarket.
She decided the didnt think she could make a corner and ate it decently hard..The speedo has lost its last battle, i fear. The seat isnt so sexy anymore and the gas tank has about 4 or 5 more bashes in it from the clipon slamming into it.
I have frozen all repairs on the hawk..I have a new tank and new tail waiting to go on, but i fear it will be until at the soonest WINTER before they go on. I feel terrible for the poor bike, it has just been getting shit on lately.
As for the girlfriend..I think she hit the ground at about 20 mph and slid on her shoulder/head. She was wearing a nice cortech jacket with CE armour everywhere, and was wearing a helmet and gloves. She has a little rash on her should (just red, not bad atal) and her thumb got smashed pretty hard. the side of her helmet acted as a brake as she slid, as she has some decent rash on the side of it.
Anyway, watching my girlfriend eat shit infront of me made me get off the 900 in such a hurry i forgot the kick stand, but, i caught the bike on its way down, it didnt hit the ground very hard at all.
The girlfriend was a trooper and she cried for a second because she felt so bad about dropping my bike, when all i felt bad about was taking her on that ride after she said she wasnt sure if she was ready for it. Either way, I got the bike up and running, gave it a check over (aside from the clipon being moved over and the speedo smashed in, it looked rideable).
She rode the bike home about 25 miles.
I am thankful she is ok as well..but the hawk is definately not getting any more money dumped into it until either I am the sole rider of it, or the girlfriend puts 1-2k miles on it.

[zooom]

I feel your pain brother...I am currently getting my wife into riding and bought her a nice Hawk of her own in awesome condition....and so far of the 3 times she has gone out on it...she has dropped it 4 times....nothing bad mind you....only real damage to speak of is the fact that I ended up having to buy a new clutch lever ( I decided at that point to buy 3 clutch and 3 brake levers as a just in case measure if this type of stuff was to continue )....and there are a couple of scratches on the mirror.....she is fearful and nervous so I kinda am worrysome about her and being out on the road....told her she is going to need to practice a whole lot around the neighborhood...repetition to a degree of comfort....hopefully she gets it!.....glad to also hear your girl wore gear and is safe.....I especially drilled that point home to my wife!

[ponley]

Have your significant others taken the MSF rider course? It is an excellent way to learn the basics from trained professional instructors (no offense to your abilities as riders but most people learn to ride and after a little while so much becomes instinctive that they don't realize they are doing something and don't pass all the information on to someone new who has not developed the instinct). They also get to learn on 250CC or less motorcycles so that when things happen they have a much better chance to recover and rather than hit the ground actually learn how to save the situation.

Google MSF and you will find a program near you, bar none the best way for a beginner to learn to ride.

[zooom]

Have your significant others taken the MSF rider course? ........They also get to learn on 250CC or less motorcycles so that when things happen they have a much better chance to recover and rather than hit the ground actually learn how to save the situation.

mine took the class and passed and got her liscence....her major problem is moreso in her head with the fact that she didn't care about the 250's they provided and just did what she had to do and didn't worry about if she wrecked or not because it wasn't her bike....now she said that the Hawk is "Sooo much heavier" which I find a little hard to swallow...heavier than a 250 yes...but not that heavy....that and she said that she actually cares about the bike so she is afraid to hurt it and all...she feels a personal stake in the bike which is good that she cares about it...but in the same degree....bikes are meant to be ridden and I want her to do just that!

[brewsy]

Soul,
glad to hear shes OK. Also good that she 'got back on the horse' as I'm sure your aware getting straight back on helps take some of the mental stress off about the incident itself.

Zoom,
I too agree that it was good she was wearing the right gear.
I CRINGE when I see most riders here in NYC!
Whether its the 'Biker Boyz' with those ridiculous looking (and damn useless in a crash) tiny German style helmets, t shirt, sneakers and jeans and/or proper full face helmet 'stuck' on the top of their heads (meaning they have a 3Kg pendulum stuck on top of their twiggy little necks, think of what happens if head meets concrete in that situation!!).
Or the other is the 'part time' riders who come out on their old clunky bikes wobbling into the office in their suits.
It only seems to be the BMW boys, who in Europe have the rep of being very 'sensible' riders (read boring) who wear decent gear.
After having several tumbles myself in London (where frankly I think traffic is worse than NYC) I always wear proper gear.
I'd rather be sweaty and red faced if it gets hot than the pretty obvious alternative when unprotected human hits hard concrete/metal!!

Is there any real reason that 'most' riders I see round here dont have decent gear?


Marc

[Soul]

Ponley,
I have to admit, no she hasnt taken the msf course. Here in idaho I think they call it the STAR course. It is in the plan, but the classes are filled until the middle of July.
And, She learned the importance of gear. As she shopped online for gear I repeatedly told her "No" on jackets she thought were cute. She half understood why I was so anal about gear because of how much gear saved my ass last year, but she thought I was excessive in my demands..Until she was sliding down and off the road...
It was destined to be a bad day though. Riding in a group of three we were cut off 3 times by cagers(i live in a college town of like 12,000, and its summer, a number like that is pretty outrageous here)..and get this...we even had bike that was an asshole. I was in the very back, as the girlfriend was new to the bike world, she was leading, and one of my other friends is also new (probably has put 3 or 400 miles on his bike) was second.
We had a guy on a BMW pass me and slide in right next to my friend, sharing his space in our staggered line. He finally sped up and remained about 5 feet directly behind bree (my girlfriend) and you could watch him randomly think about squeezing by her on the right.
Anyway, it freaked her out because she kept seeing a biker she didnt know right behind her, invading her space. I think it was the most upset i had ever been at a fellow biker while out riding and i was about 1 second away from getting right up next to him and giving him a peice of my mind. You know the quick, quit being a fawking asshole, my bike will eat your bike and you dont see me riding like an aggressive freak.
Anyway, after about 1 or 2 miles of riding her ass he decided to pass the group of cars we were behind..
So. destined to be a bad day..and to my amazement, after the wreck (there was some plastic and other random chunks in the road next to the bike, an obvious wreck) no bikes stopped, but 1 or 2 cages did.

[ponley]

Zoom,

First of all, I don't know your wife but it is gennerally a safe bet that she is shorter than you. Her shorter legs will make that weight that doesn't seem like much to you seem on the verge of taking her down at any moment. If this is the case you can try to find womens riding boots that have thicker soles to help her get both feet on the ground. Then it is just a matter of remembering how you felt the first time you rode, practice practice practice.

Soul,

Spend some more time in the quiet parking lots and make sure she has a very good grasp of the controls, brakes and clutch. It is when the new rider has to take just an extra split second to remember which is the brake lever or to pull in the clutch first that things start to snowball. remember that when you are approaching the same corner you don't have to think which is the brake, how many gears to downshift, or even how fast do I think I am or can go here. What really happened to her is that she was trying to think about all of this and no capacity left to remember the MOST IMPORTANT thing both of you guys need to drill into their heads. Look where you want to go because you ARE GOING to go where you look. I understand the mindset of putting her out in front so that she can set a comfortable pace for herself and you can watch her but, if you see her get into trouble can you do anything from the back to help her? No. Ride upfront, set a good controlled pace and wear something bright red and tell her to always look over your shoulder ahead of you. When you go around a corner she can practice looking at you and learn to look where she wants to go. She'll also have to benifit of your brake light to give her more advanced notice of the need to slow down and your judgement of corner entry speed to help keep her out of trouble.

When you guys are out there with new riders try to remember that using all four limbs for multiple controls each is something new to them and try to keep things slow and easy so that they can learn to become instinctive with the controls, the riding skill will then follow nicely.

Count yourselves lucky that they are joining you rather than telling you the bike or me, one of us has to go.

[Soul]

I am proud of her..and I dont think she got the controls messed up, she just didnt have faith in herself or the bike. And, yes, it was my bad not leading her through the twisties..But really, it was a nice slow arc of a corner and she just didnt think she could make it, she panicked and hit the brakes..I guess it just happened, but its true, I bet it wouldnt have happened if I had been leading. :cry:

[zooom]

Ponley,

she is 2-3 inches chorter than me but has the exact same inseam length as me....so I don't think it is a reach issue...though she does have some boots that have a slightly thicker sole and a bit more heel for her own comfort....so I understand the patience thing and all...but a big part of me wants there to be a catch net there to help her as I won't always be there to do so as she is still just not getting the hang of the dynamics and trusting your tires as you lean and so forth.

Zoom,

First of all, I don't know your wife but it is gennerally a safe bet that she is shorter than you. Her shorter legs will make that weight that doesn't seem like much to you seem on the verge of taking her down at any moment. If this is the case you can try to find womens riding boots that have thicker soles to help her get both feet on the ground. Then it is just a matter of remembering how you felt the first time you rode, practice practice practice.

When you guys are out there with new riders try to remember that using all four limbs for multiple controls each is something new to them and try to keep things slow and easy so that they can learn to become instinctive with the controls, the riding skill will then follow nicely.

Count yourselves lucky that they are joining you rather than telling you the bike or me, one of us has to go.

[dagus]

Soul,

Glad to hear your Bree is OK and was properly geared up (it's a fight to get my wife to wear any gear at all on my bike, even gloves). Get her a pair of armored pants to go with that jacket, and make her take that MSF course ASAP. Two days before my MSF date, I took the Hawk out for a similar first-time spin (all of one block), and did the same damn thing. Came to a stop a few feet from a fire hydrant trying to turn onto my street. Had no idea what the fawk I was doing... everybody NEEDS that course! Slow speed turns suck hard at first... you remember!

Tell Bree that it's not if you go down, it's when, and hers is over with. Now it's all about learn... learn... learn...
She sounds like a total trooper. OK, bud, so now we want pics of the girl with the bike - proudly holding her rashed helmet, of course!

[ponley]

Soul,
I didn't mean to say that she messed up the controls, She just had to think about them which is something that you don't do once you have a few thousand miles under your belt. In Keith Code's books there is an idea that applies here. You have a dollars worth of brain power and everything you do on the bike needs a little bit if it. When you approach a corner you look at the turn, the surface and pick your speed, 50 cents, at the same time your clutching 2 cents, braking 2 cents, downshifting 2 cents. You've 44 cents in change to deal with any surprises. When a beginer is approaching the same corner they see the turn and try to judge their speed 50 cents, pull in clutch 15 cents, brake 15 cents, check surface 15 cents, and if all this went well they get through the corner and realize that they have not downshifted and are still in 4 gear going 15 miles an hour. the leftover 5 cents was not enough to remember the downshift part. It's not that she messed up, she just has to think about each little thing and when you approach a turn and add them all up it was too much data to process. If you lead then she doesn't need to navigate, when you slow she slows with you and you pick the speed so she doesn't have to. In the begining if you do that work then she can get more familiar with the bike till it is second nature and she no longer thinks about it.

Remember when you first learned to drive a stick shift? I do, great story, I was in drivers ed in high school, learners permit, supposed to drive at home with parents for practice. The car was a Plymouth Cricket, 1974 4 cylinder econo-box. I remember comming up to a left turn over a set of traintracks with a raised grade. I knew I had to downshift, slow down, signal, and turn. Well, as I recall the downshift went pretty well, got the signal on, hit the brakes, well by now I was a little further down the road than I wanted to be so I started cranking the wheel like a madman and clipped the curb knocking off the right front hubcap and comming to a complete stop on the hill of the grade crossing. Without saying a word I set the hand brake, got out and picked up the hubcap, and got back in the back seat. ops: Sound a little like Bree's turn? I just had a couple training wheels is the only difference. The point is I had to think about the downshift, then the signal, then the brakes and by that time I was past the turn. Now I hit the signal as I reach for the shift lever and clutch and brake at the same time and after the turn I don't even remember it.

Take away the distractions and work on the controls till they are second nature. And try to remember your first few rides. Really the MSF courses are worth their weight in gold, those guys know the best way to teach someone to ride.